Wednesday, January 14, 2009

Ignatieff - Trudeau follow-up or The Iggy Conundrum

I normally reply to comments by the use of follow-up comments. But a comment by TMOS on yesterday's post articulated a lot of my reticence about a full blown support for Ignatieff. I decided in this case to quote the comment and my response in a new post.

The Mound of Sound:
The clips show another Ignatieff altogether. That Iggy wouldn't have championed the conquest of Iraq, wouldn't have endorsed "enhanced interrogation" or tied the Liberal Party to Israel over Gaza. Had Trudeau seen today's Iggy he wouldn't have given him the time of day, much less an interview.
Despite all his faults, Pierre Trudeau had convictions and integrity, essential qualities in a Liberal leader which Ignatieff has abandoned in favour of personal ambition and expediency.
TMOS has brought up a very good point. I have been reading up on Mr. Ignatieff, his musings on human rights and his stand on Iraq and the subsequent recanting of this.

Was his earlier work on group and individual rights a sham? Was he truly a disciple of Isaiah Berlin? Perhaps he, like many others, was deluded by the way the Bush regime manipulated the agenda in the aftermath of 9/11. Maybe this gullibility should invalidate him from high office. Trudeau made a mistake on the War Measures Act. Did this make him a bad Prime Minsiter in the final analysis? Is the humourous nature of the universe going to assert itself by having history label Chretien as the one who was right on the Iraq file? At this date I must confess that I really don't know.

I haven't gotten to "The Lesser Evil" yet but the reviews I have read indicate that the views expressed therin are worrisome. As are Wikipedia accounts as to what he considers to be torture. I suppose Mr. Ignatieff would label me as a human rights perfectionist because I can't condone what he is purported to support as interrogation techniques.

I would like nothing more than to believe that Mr. Ignatieff was going to the lead the Liberals into office as the manifestation of a human rights champion. But as his recent stance on Gaza indicates, he will need to be watched closely

An idle question. When did TMOS change the name of his blog? I must have missed it while I was on the blogrogation.Recommend this Post


Anonymous said...

would like nothing more than to believe that Mr. Ignatieff was going to the lead the Liberals into office as the manifestation of a human rights champion. But as his recent stance on Gaza indicates, he will need to be watched closely
He does seem to be more of a "champion" when it to Omar Khadr - but then it's easy given that Obama will be closing the prison.
Dallaire was a vocal champion for the longest time.

(there is also a new Liberal aggregator - )

The Mound of Sound said...

As you asked, I chose to become "The Disaffected Liberal" when I came to question my continued affiliation with the party under the control of Michael Ignatieff.

I haven't been a fan of any Liberal leader or contender since Paul Martin. I stayed with Dion despite reservations about his suitability. When Iggy blew Dion out of the water I urged a lot of outraged dissenters to stay with the party and give the guy a chance to earn their loyalty. That's what I did but his apparent indifference to Liberal tradition by abandoning at least relative impartiality to embrace a cause that by any measure was not just crushed any prospect of supporting Ignatieff. I left liblogs over the same issue after a measure of ugliness and decided it was time for a fresh start with a fresh blog title.

I am a genuinely disaffected Liberal.



janfromthebruce said...

Well, you give some cover to Iggy re:Iraq, but I really have to challenge that cover. Sitting here in Canada at the time, most Canadians were astounded by the idiocy of the American people to believe the crock of shit coming out of Bush re:weapons of mass destruction. Daily in the papers was reports that none had been found.
Iggy is a smart man and a good scholar, which means he would have the training and ability to search out other sources, beyond fox news channel to realize that Bush was full of BS. Sorry, but I don't buy it that Iggy just made a mistake. Iggy believed (and probably still does) in empire.
That is the worse kind of elitism.
Which brings me to Gaza. He would have the academic ability and access to information that would challenge his flawed reasoning of seeing Israel as the "victim" and not "victimizer." He is purposefully turning a blind eye for political reasons.

janfromthebruce said...

Up and can't sleep, so decided read some posts and tags to blogs. Came across this little tidbit and thought I would link it, and provide some more food for thought.
In an interview with VP Cheney Cheney On Whether Iraq War Was Worth The 4,500 Americans Killed: ‘I Think So’, he responded, "I think so."
However, The harsh reality is that this was not a noble undertaking done for good reasons. It was a criminal enterprise launched by madmen cheered on by a chorus of fools and cowards. And it’s seen as such by virtually everyone all around the world — including but by no means limited to the Arab world.
So was Michael a fool or a coward? Remember, he likes to talk about how attached he was to Canada even though he was living in the states. That means, he would have access to and want knowledge of what Canadian political feel was for this war, Canada being his home country.
I will restate, he would have lots of access to information that would reveal the "war propaganda". Since he wasn't in a political position (unlike Trudeau who was PM) where he had to make a rapid decision, but one of reflective academic with time and resources to seek truth, makes him either a fool or a coward. However, I think he is worse than those descriptors. I think that he is part of the power elite, and wanting to gain more status - thus a coward.
His affinity to America and their "interests" makes me realize that this liberal leader could lead us to backing up the American folly of their geopolitical interests.

Constant Vigilance said...

CWTF - Dallaire is a true hero. It was through reading an article on him that I came across Genocide Watch. Thanks for pointing out the new aggregator. I was always wary about Liblogs and this reticence seems to have been substantiated. I have decided to join up and give this one a try.

TMOS - Very well reasoned explanation as to the name change. I agree about Martin. It seems to be in vogue to slag him these days. I give him credit for setting up both the "Adscam" and Arar Committees. Regardless of the motives that others attributed to these actions, the point is he set them up.

JFTB - If I gave the impression of providing cover for Ignatieff on Iraq, I apologize for poor composition. I am hopeful that this reflects rust rather than ineptitude.

I meant to give the impression of someone who is struggling to be certain of the position of the Liberal leader on an issue at the core of human existence.